Shield worthwhile on a tank?

[Corbie]

So ive got a character concept I want to make, Shield and Battle Axe, and im trying to decide which class to make him.

 

My first instinct is to go tanker cause I just enjoy playing tanks.  However, the shield set doesnt seem very Tank friendly.  Its a mostly defensive set, and I always feel like if you arent going resistances, you are wasting your tank.

 

Im just wondering if anyone feels like Shield is a worthwhile choice for a tank, and if not..is there a class you would say is the best, or good, choice for Shield?

[ZacKing]

Absolutely worthwhile IMO.  No idea why you'd think shield isn't tank friendly.  Resistances aren't much of an issue when you aren't getting hit.  Have a couple of shield tanks myself.  Shield/Broadsword, Shield/Psi Melee are both really fun.  Working on Shield/Dark Melee next.  My son loves his Shield/SJ tanker.  Definitely worthwhile IMO.

[Hyperstrike]

Shield is DEFINITELY a worthwhile tank.

And built right, is tough enough to survive anything but super-cheaty kill mechanics.

[Werner]

Worthwhile? WORTHWHILE?! It's amazing on Tankers! 😁 And I think of it as a hybrid defense/resist set once you have an endgame build, particularly on Tankers. Here's my Shield/MA in Mids'.

 

Also, that's with a single stack of the Tanker ATO, so add another 6.7% to 13.4% and cap smashing/lethal. Reactive Defenses can kick in with up to another 10%. I use Amplifiers, so add another 7.5%. And you could have much better psionic resistance - I just chose to focus on other things. I'm not saying that Shield has the resistance of a hard core resistance set, but it's actually quite good. You can play any AT you want of course, and I'm sure you'll have fun, but if you want a Shield/Axe Tanker, go for it. It's great. You'll do great.

Edited September 24, 2021 by Werner

[Wavicle]

4 hours ago, Corbie said:

I always feel like if you arent going resistances, you are wasting your tank

 

This might possibly have been true back in the day, but now with IOs so available it's just not so.

[DreadShinobi]

Shield defense has excellent base values with tanker modifiers - both defensively and offensively. It is definitely a better choice for tankers than brutes or stalkers - and a bit of a tossup between tank / scrapper. 

[Sovera]

If you mean worthwhile by best, then yes, it's worthwhile.

[Hjarki]

I'd argue Scrapper is a better choice.

 

As you noted, playing a non-Resist Tanker is a tough choice because of that high resist cap. While a Shield Tanker will normally S/L cap, they'll have weaker resists elsewhere. Moreover, a large chunk of those resists will come from IO set bonuses that are the same for both Tanker and Scrapper. So while the Tanker will be tougher than the Scrapper, it will be more like 30% vs. 40% resist rather than 75% vs. 90% resist.

 

Scrappers have a higher base damage and get more benefit from Against all Odds.

 

Battle Axe has a terrible first attack (which Tankers are forced to take but Scrappers are not).

 

Pendulum is the same arc on both Tankers and Scrappers (Tankers can hit twice as many targets, though).

 

That being said, I tend to reserve 'Tanker' for builds where I'm going to pursue builds that are designed to withstand almost anything - Recluse, Reichsman, Hamidon, etc. - while I go with the more damage-oriented AT on anything that is merely decent at surviving most things.

[MrAxe]

Its forking brilliant! My main is a Shield/Psi Tank. 😀

[Bill Z Bubba]

I did the Werner Rules ITF with my shield/em tank. So far, the only thing that's taken her down was a +4 Aeon in the MLTF. Cuz he's a cheating cheater that cheats. AND I was following standard max diff/no insps/no temps/no deaths rules.

 

Shield, as I've seen, is the BEST secondary for a tank.

[Bill Z Bubba]

2 hours ago, Hjarki said:

So while the Tanker will be tougher than the Scrapper, it will be more like 30% vs. 40% resist rather than 75% vs. 90% resist.

 

This statement appears to ignore the much higher HP given to the tank. I'm sitting on 3000+ with mine and all the extra regen it allows. Thanks to the tank AT IO, as Werner mentions, I'm often hard capped to S/L damage and close to it on Nrg/NegNrg/Fire/Cold while also being softcapped to all positions.

[KaoticKarl]

I had to do a double take on this thread, as I thought it was a joke at first 😆

 

This is my Shield/Energy Tanker with one enemy in range, solo, no incarnates running, single stack of Tanker ATO:

 

Add in one party member in range and incarnates running, you get this:

 

And for the pièce de résistance, fully saturated with 3 other players in range. Adding in double stack of Tanker ATO (+6.7%), and my lowest is Psi at 85.38% resists with all others above cap:

 

Tell me again how resistances will be low on a shield tanker? Sure, my damage isn't that of a scrapper, but it never would be, and that's ok with me. I can solo pretty much any TF I want, provided I expect the final boss to take a bit of extra time. Although since I went energy, it's not as bad as you might think, but still.. pretty much unkillable to anything, as my regen offsets both hits and self-damage from ET in a blink. Funny thing is, I didn't even like Shield at first and never gave it a real try, but soon grew to love it. Shoutout to @Infinitum for his help on my build - gave great examples and general advice!

[Bill Z Bubba]

Oh yea... plus 87% DDR when double stacking AD. It's freakin sick. And then there's that 3 min pylon time when saturating AAO while using NrgMel.

[ZemX]

25 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Shield, as I've seen, is the BEST secondary for a tank.

 

*cough* primary *cough*

[Bill Z Bubba]

Just now, ZemX said:

*cough* primary *cough*

 

I am very corrected.

 

/does math

 

Ok, make that "Shield is the best armor set in the game" regardless of archetype. 🙂

[UltraAlt]

19 hours ago, Corbie said:

So ive got a character concept I want to make, Shield and Battle Axe, and im trying to decide which class to make him.

 

My first instinct is to go tanker cause I just enjoy playing tanks.  However, the shield set doesnt seem very Tank friendly.  Its a mostly defensive set, and I always feel like if you arent going resistances, you are wasting your tank.

 

Im just wondering if anyone feels like Shield is a worthwhile choice for a tank, and if not..is there a class you would say is the best, or good, choice for Shield?

 

To me it isn't a waste of time to experiment and I always go with character conception.

 If my conception is that the character has a shield, they have a shield.

If I want them to taunt the team, then, of course, a tank.

If I want to jump around and cause damage, then I would make a scrapper.

 

There is obviously no reason that you can't make both and jump between your alts when the mood arises.

 

I've kind of been anchored down by a teammate to play one character with them until we reach 50 - mix-and-repeat - when we game together.

I like jumping around and playing whatever I feel like playing that day or the character I think will fit best with whatever team I'm joining.

 

I have a couple of shield characters. I've ended up playing the shield scrapper more than the shield tank lately, but that is mainly because my shield scrapper is a lower level.

 

And back to the start, I say go with your character conception.

[Gobbledigook]

21 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

I am very corrected.

 

/does math

 

Ok, make that "Shield is the best armor set in the game" regardless of archetype. 🙂

I still prefer my Rad armor (or dark armor) even though Shield is better 99% of the time. Some content really tests Rad Armor which gives some fun moments of trying to stay alive whilst taking the mobs out. More exciting than Shield in my opinion. But each to their own 🙂

[Linea]

SD is a very good choice.

 

Armor Types (Armor Recommendations):

Spoiler

 

I recommend:   

Defense Armor: EnA (Any AT), Inv/ and SD/ as the Tank Alternatives.    
Resist Armor: RadA (Brutes and Tanks Only).   
Heal Armor: Bio (Any AT, paired with a Defensive Weapon).   

 

Defense Armors, Expanded and In Order of Durability: EnA (Any AT, Add Resists, Intermediate), SR (Advanced), SD (Intermediate), Inv (Easy). If you’re not picking EnA, I Recommend Inv. Inv is very easy to learn and drive, and very durable. Once you get your feet under you, then you can pick some of the more difficult to drive armors. My personal Favorites are EnA and SD, but I find myself driving EnA and Inv most often.

Notes:
•    Stone can still be very good, I just very much dislike Stone. I would rank stone somewhere between Inv and SD for durability.
•    EnA is not on tanks, if it ever is, I might be forced to move it up or down the ratings, depending on how it's ported.
•    Most SR builds do not add the resists required to get it to the rating I give it. SR is also the most difficult to drive if built my way.
•    Most SD builds also do not add the resists required to get to the rating I give it. I use all three SD build slots: Defense, Psi-Tank, Proc/Offense.
•    Inv is more likely to be built to defensive spec, it's just kinda naturally built that way. It's also so easy to drive. It's pretty much recommends itself.

 

 

Lucy SD/RadM 801 Build, solo: 

(I'm running Rune/Hybrid/Rune/OwtS/KitchenSink as needed for resists.  She was built this way on purpose, and with that intent.  But even without it's absurdly durable.)

Edited September 24, 2021 by Linea

[Bill Z Bubba]

10 minutes ago, Gobbledegook said:

I still prefer my Rad armor (or dark armor) even though Shield is better 99% of the time. Some content really tests Rad Armor which gives some fun moments of trying to stay alive whilst taking the mobs out. More exciting than Shield in my opinion. But each to their own 🙂

 

As stated elsewhere, the discussion on what armor set is best on the fun scale is a whole different discussion.

 

I will always love the fire and forget nature of SR and its ability to allow me to slide through spawns.

[Bastille Boy]

My Shield Defense/Energy Melee tanker is the only character I have that can solo the very difficult AE 801.2 mission at max difficulty. I took Hybrid Melee Core but did not include Rune of Protection or One with the Shield in the build. (I can't solo AE 801.3. That probably requires a Hybrid-Rune-OwtS rotation.)

 

If you are looking for extreme durability and solid damage, Shield tankers are a great choice. 

[Erratic1]

6 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

I am very corrected.

 

/does math

 

Ok, make that "Shield is the best armor set in the game" regardless of archetype. 🙂

 

Energy Aura glances up, notices its the AT that doesn't get access to it and shrugs.

[ninja surprise]

On 9/24/2021 at 10:41 AM, Bill Z Bubba said:

I will always love the fire and forget nature of SR and its ability to allow me to slide through spawns.

 

And the occasional glowie-click in a room full of very angry mobs just whiffing away while that glowie's progress bar decays.

[Haijinx]

On 9/24/2021 at 11:33 AM, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

This statement appears to ignore the much higher HP given to the tank. I'm sitting on 3000+ with mine and all the extra regen it allows. Thanks to the tank AT IO, as Werner mentions, I'm often hard capped to S/L damage and close to it on Nrg/NegNrg/Fire/Cold while also being softcapped to all positions.

 

Those resist numbers sound low also.  You can get 70% S/L on a SR tanker, and it doesn't even have any Resist in set outside the scaling mechanic.  A Shield would be better

 

Maybe ignoring the resist ATO?  Which admittedly on some tanks is kind of Meh.  But on Def tanks is pretty good. 

[Haijinx]

On 9/24/2021 at 12:41 PM, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

As stated elsewhere, the discussion on what armor set is best on the fun scale is a whole different discussion.

 

 

Fire Blaster

[Wavicle]

Illusion Controller