Corruptors vs Blasters

[Snarky]

I never liked Corruptors on live.  I played villains.  Why do villains want to be healers?  Still have issues with this.

 

But....  In trying to find the best Dark Dark Dark Soul Dark Darkity BLACK Darkness I am slowly settling into a Dark^3 Corruptor.

 

I am used to healing myself as I play a lot of Dark.  So using the team heal is not a big stretch, and I try not to be the "team medic"  If you are near me, fine.  If not, sucks to be you.  The -regen on the target is sweet.  Very vampire.  Give me your life.

 

The to hit debuffs, and style (for me Disorienting so I can Soul Drain for power!) are just better on the Corruptor.  It seems to me.

 

But generally speaking (from a quick glance) It seems like when the fight is hard a Corruptors damage is better than a Blasters.  They have the power to debuff regen, or res, or to hit, and the Scourge mechanic to finish the job.  Am I missing something?  

 

Of course I have a Fire Blaster.  With no defenses.  No nothing.  Except Fire.  Roasting everything works 95% time.

 

 

[MoonSheep]

in my opinion i can’t see any reason to play a corrupter over a defender - stronger buffs/debuffs and damage mostly the same

 

with the power level access changes, defenders become an even better choice. scourge feels a bit worthless given enemies are almost dead anyway

[Greycat]

11 minutes ago, Snarky said:

Why do villains want to be healers?

 

Whenever I hear someone advertise themselves as a "healer," I cringe, regardless of side.  Defender or Corrupter, you *should* be doing so much more. (Still, as a direct answer? It's bodies that aren't yours soaking up incoming fire.)

 

As far as corrupter vs blaster? *shrug* Depends what it is, what you're fighting, how you're playing maybe. I know my Seismic blaster pretty well chews through anything.

[Snarky]

27 minutes ago, MoonSheep said:

in my opinion i can’t see any reason to play a corrupter over a defender - stronger buffs/debuffs and damage mostly the same

 

with the power level access changes, defenders become an even better choice. scourge feels a bit worthless given enemies are almost dead anyway

In my particular case the Corruptor just "feels" right.  But that is probably just opinion of a Villain lol

[Clave Dark 5]

46 minutes ago, Snarky said:

Of course I have a Fire Blaster.  With no defenses.  No nothing.  Except Fire.  Roasting everything works 95% time.

Off topic:  I am still near-irrationally angry about how "every build MUST taken Tough and Weave", partly because I hate taking a throw-away power, partly because as I'm leveling up and go "woo, another level!  Run to the trainer, check my document for the exciting new power aaand...  it's 'Tough.'  Whee. (heavy sigh)"

 

So I am happy to e hearing this, I really should give it a shot with something stupid like a petless mastermind or something.

[Glacier Peak]

Yes, yes! Indeed - Snarky as you will probably remember Corruptors were initially the villain equivalent of Defenders, but with less direct healing capability (Empathy was proliferated after launch). They had Thermal Radiation at CoV launch and then shield and individual buffs. Corruptors were stylized as a mix between Blaster and Defender, and as you pointed out in the Ice/Cold thread, they don't debuff as well as a Defender or Blast as hard as a Blaster - but they do both really well and their Inherent power provides utility beyond the initial niche situation (think about Scourge activating on AVs and GMs). 

 

As more sets have been proliferated between Defenders and Corruptors, the differences became less clear. Sure their Inherent powers are different (Defender Inherent power was not always the same as it is today either!) and so are their base/max attribute values, but play style wise, they have become essentially synonymous with each other. Much like Brutes (and really Mastermind's) filled the Tank role villain side, Dominators were Controllers, and Stalkers were Scrappers, I think they chose to combine the Blaster and Defender feel in to one Archetype villain side, and that was the origin of Corruptors.

 

So noting those differences and similarities, I think the current meta provides both Archetypes with a unique feel. 

[lemming]

12 minutes ago, Clave Dark 5 said:

Off topic:  I am still near-irrationally angry about how "every build MUST taken Tough and Weave", partly because I hate taking a throw-away power, partly because as I'm leveling up and go "woo, another level!  Run to the trainer, check my document for the exciting new power aaand...  it's 'Tough.'  Whee. (heavy sigh)"

 

So I am happy to e hearing this, I really should give it a shot with something stupid like a petless mastermind or something.

It's a freewheeling way to play.  I need to respec my fire/fire/fire after the latest patch so that I can shift that not so damaging immobilize pick

[macskull]

45 minutes ago, MoonSheep said:

in my opinion i can’t see any reason to play a corrupter over a defender - stronger buffs/debuffs and damage mostly the same

 

with the power level access changes, defenders become an even better choice. scourge feels a bit worthless given enemies are almost dead anyway

I'm the exact opposite - with a few exceptions I find little reason to play a Defender over a Corruptor. The higher damage cap is huge, and while it's true Scourge is kinda useless most of the time, it really adds up against hard targets (and honestly that's the only time sustained DPS is relevant since other mobs will die quickly anyways).

[Doomguide2005]

48 minutes ago, Snarky said:

I never liked Corruptors on live.  I played villains.  Why do villains want to be healers?  Still have issues with this.

     How about this.  Both Defender and Corruptor (or Blaster etc.) are concepts or labels applied by the Players of a game.  Your character doesn't think of themselves that way.  Their stats aren't them, they're a game based way of quickly defining them to others playing a game  They just know they can do x,y and z.  "I" heal not because I'm a Defender or Corruptor, Blaster or Tanker.  I heal because I need sustenance, enjoy the warm rush of blood (and more) or maybe the expression of my hunts success as I feed or a lot of other possibilities.   They may even call themselves a Defender or Corruptor but they aren't thinking of it the way a player thinks of it when another Player uses those terms.  You have a hang-up, your character doesn't.  They're busy being themselves, a complex set of moral, ethical and often contradictory beliefs and behaviors (and oblivious to the Player and Game they are in)

[MoonSheep]

37 minutes ago, macskull said:

I'm the exact opposite - with a few exceptions I find little reason to play a Defender over a Corruptor. The higher damage cap is huge, and while it's true Scourge is kinda useless most of the time, it really adds up against hard targets (and honestly that's the only time sustained DPS is relevant since other mobs will die quickly anyways).

 

if buffs or debuffs are on offer i like to play the Full Fat version of it and then choose a blast set for its secondary effects; end drain, -acc etc

 

i used to have a fire/fire corrupter back on live and played it solely redside, it was a good alt, definitely more offensive than a def

[PLVRIZR]

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

I am used to healing myself as I play a lot of Dark.  So using the team heal is not a big stretch, and I try not to be the "team medic"  If you are near me, fine.  If not, sucks to be you.  The -regen on the target is sweet.  Very vampire.  Give me your life.

Agreed, love that power...and don't forget the Theft of Essence +end proc in TG, to also refill your blue bar 😄

[MTeague]

I mean, while every AT can solo, and I do solo quite a bit, the game was designed as an MMO and there's a lot of assumptions of team play in some designs.  Most notably in your bubbler sets, but even beyond that. 

 

It's not unreasonable that blasters were for massive damage after teammates had already applied debuffs.

Sure they have their own secondary effects, but nothing to compare with corruptors, defenders, MM's, etc.

 

[Darkir]

2 hours ago, Snarky said:

I never liked Corruptors on live.  I played villains.  Why do villains want to be healers?  Still have issues with this.

 

But....  In trying to find the best Dark Dark Dark Soul Dark Darkity BLACK Darkness I am slowly settling into a Dark^3 Corruptor.

 

I am used to healing myself as I play a lot of Dark.  So using the team heal is not a big stretch, and I try not to be the "team medic"  If you are near me, fine.  If not, sucks to be you.  The -regen on the target is sweet.  Very vampire.  Give me your life.

 

The to hit debuffs, and style (for me Disorienting so I can Soul Drain for power!) are just better on the Corruptor.  It seems to me.

 

But generally speaking (from a quick glance) It seems like when the fight is hard a Corruptors damage is better than a Blasters.  They have the power to debuff regen, or res, or to hit, and the Scourge mechanic to finish the job.  Am I missing something?  

 

Of course I have a Fire Blaster.  With no defenses.  No nothing.  Except Fire.  Roasting everything works 95% time.

 

 

For a triple dark character min/max wise a defender is likely best, but I'm glad you are enjoying the corruptor. Triple dark defenders and corruptors are fun because you can do a lot of interesting things with the powers in those sets:

 

dark pit+oppressive gloom+stun proc'd dark consumption, tar patch+soul drain+blackstar, dark servant (Fluffy!)+petrifying gaze, lots of fun proc interactions, etc.

 

Those three powersets are great on their own, but work really well together mechanically and thematically. 

Edited November 19, 2022 by Darkir

[Astralock]

1 hour ago, macskull said:

I'm the exact opposite - with a few exceptions I find little reason to play a Defender over a Corruptor. The higher damage cap is huge, and while it's true Scourge is kinda useless most of the time, it really adds up against hard targets (and honestly that's the only time sustained DPS is relevant since other mobs will die quickly anyways).

Yep.  Sonic Resonance is the only support power set I would ever play as a Defender.  The rest, Corruptor all the way.  The differences in buff and debuff values aren’t significant enough to notice.  The damage difference, however, is.  Especially, as you noted, against hard targets.

 

Whenever I see a Kinetics or Trick Arrow Defender, or a Defender with Fire Blast, Ice Blast, or Water Blast, I wince inside.

Edited November 19, 2022 by Astralock

[MHertz]

In my view, the original Corruptor sets should have been modified to be more like Sentinel secondaries. Defenders are mostly about helping others; Corruptors should have been designed to help themselves more (and if allies are helped also, so be it). Unfortunately, the limitation of the code against self-targeting really hurt the design possibilities.

[MistressOhm]

Someone said this back in the Live days, and it's got a few grains of truth to it:

 

"Defenders Benefit the Team" - the powersets are designed so that they 'force multiply' what the team is doing.

 

"The Team Benefits the Corruptor" - while the powersets do have 'team' benefits, they also leverage the team's contributions to 'force multiply' what the corruptor is doing.

[Snarky]

4 hours ago, PLVRIZR said:

Agreed, love that power...and don't forget the Theft of Essence +end proc in TG, to also refill your blue bar 😄

I got it in both my heals lol

[Zect]

Blasters do more dps than corruptors. My beam/TA/munitions munches a pylon in ~2:20 without summoning lores; you do the math on how much dps that is.

 

However, corruptors are an S tier AT. They are just much better all-round, without being too far behind blasters damage-wise. 8 corruptors can do anything except Hami. For Hami you need 50 corruptors.

 

Some AT's edge out corrs slightly for specific applications and situations, like farming, but ultimately in CoX the most powerful thing anyone can have is a support powerset.

[Ukase]

When comparing AT's, it's largely subjective for playstyle preference. 
For assessing DPS, the contrast between corruptor and defender is fairly straightforward. BUT  - I said this last night over Discord when asked. There is no "best", but there may be a "Best for you". 

Some players can squeeze out more NET dps from a defender than from a corruptor. The reverse is also true. But, with scourge, the Corruptor comes out on top, except when solo. 

As far as Corruptor vs Blaster, let us assume the dps averages out. The blaster has a higher base of hitpoints. Instead of casting a PBAoE buff like a corruptor might, the blaster has a sustain that typically boosts regen/recovery. But, the blaster doesn't have any buffs to share, unless it's the leadership pool, and values for that are pretty low for both (per city of data 2.0) ATs. 

I would suggest making both, the blaster and the corruptor. I'm confident that you'll see a difference between the dps in most cases. But anecotally, my fire/rad corruptor seemed to do roughly the same dps as my fire/fire blaster. The only time I saw a real difference was when I was soloing a boss. The damage that blaze and Fire blast do from the corruptor just isn't as nice as the blaster's. The scourge helps, of course, but my blaster is better at it. And it probably should be. 

Mind you, with certain powersets and wise use of damage procs and global recharge, you might outshine some blasters. Just not all of them. 

[Erratic1]

9 hours ago, MoonSheep said:

 

if buffs or debuffs are on offer i like to play the Full Fat version of it and then choose a blast set for its secondary effects; end drain, -acc etc

 

i used to have a fire/fire corrupter back on live and played it solely redside, it was a good alt, definitely more offensive than a def

 

Well yes, if you're focus is on buffs/debuffs, you're going to go Defender. But there is a meaningful damage difference between Defender and Corruptors.

[Erratic1]

8 hours ago, Astralock said:

Yep.  Sonic Resonance is the only support power set I would ever play as a Defender.  The rest, Corruptor all the way.  The differences in buff and debuff values aren’t significant enough to notice.  The damage difference, however, is.  Especially, as you noted, against hard targets.

 

Whenever I see a Kinetics or Trick Arrow Defender, or a Defender with Fire Blast, Ice Blast, or Water Blast, I wince inside.

 

*checks City of Data for Electrical Affinity differences and sees no reason to regret choosing to play it as a Defender*

[blue4333]

Something about the Scourge Procs that fill the screen makes it super satisfying playing a corruptor. 
 

water/cold or storm? Chef’s kiss

[carroto]

I have plenty of Blasters and Corruptors.  The Blasters tend to get a bit boring after a while.  Corruptors have more to do.  The biggest difference for me in solo play is the "Blast through mez" from the new Defiance.  I couldn't hope to count how many times that has saved me.  It's great to have some way to act to save myself if I don't happen to have a Break-Free on hand, as opposed to just impotently watching myself get defeated.

 

In theory a D3 Corruptor should be able to debuff tohit enough to have a kind of ghetto mez protection, but for me in practice it doesn't tend to work out.  Plenty of mobs will open with a mez, so if your opener doesn't debuff them enough to make their mez miss, it could be game over for you.  Dark Miasma is really not helped in this regard by all of its long animations, making it slow to apply those debuffs and heals.  Of course once you get the Dark Servant a lot of that gets eased as it's a great debuffer and distraction.

 

I don't know how much of an issue mez is for you, so maybe none of that matters.  I don't play Dark Miasma anymore personally.  I tend to play secondaries that either provide mez protection or at least some defense that doesn't get shut down when mezzed.  There aren't a whole lot that fit that bill, which is the only thing that limits my stable of Corruptors.

[Snarky]

I carry 2-5 break frees at 50.  Depending on mission.

 

Great stuff so far.  I been on 9 Task/Strike forces with this guy today (since rebuild) including a MoLGTF. 

 

The playstyle is a bit wonky compared to the Blaster.  Which, a dark/dark Blaster is a bit wonky compared to say a Fire/Temporal. 

 

But there are more options with a Corruptor, which feels like more power. Having options to control movement and heal team, rez ally, are important.  Usually needed on a crap pug team, but important lol. 

 

On the MoLGTF I honestly could have been on a Blaster built with the two AoE mag 2 stuns and played almost the same.  I used Tar Patch some and fearsome Stare a LOT.  Using Twilight Grasp as a regen debuff on Hard Targets. 

 

The Nuke could hit harder, like on the Dark Blaster.  I am committed to a Dark/Dark thing, but I drool over my Fire Blasters Nuke.  that thing clears rooms and cleans the walls as well.  A Dark Blaster does more damage than A Dark Corruptor.  But when Scourge kicks in it is sweet. 

 

A Dark Blasters (for me) offers only more damage for me and nothing else, well the sustain is nice.  I do not use melee attacks.  All other powers are the same or similar.  With to hit debuffs stronger on Corruptor of course.  Then the Corruptor has more tools in the kit. The only thing I lack on the Corruptor is a ST hold.  There is one but I need two and there is no way to get two on the Corruptor. (using just Dark/Dark-Dark/Soul) So I left that out.  The Blaster can hold Paragon Protectors and Victoria Robots with that trick.  The Corruptor will just need to slap Darkest Night and Fear Stare the things.

 

I think playing the Corruptor well is challenging.  You have to constantly assess the mission, your teammates, and your next ten seconds of activity.  Stun and go in or stun and stay back? To hit debuff this group with fearsome stare?  Time for PBAoE chain? Cone Aoe chain? heal / rez duty? Is there a Boss that needs Darkest Night? Is Fluffy still up? Tar Patch here or there? Use Howling Twilight to floor the bosses regen or save it?  With Blasting you are just trying to decide whether to burn ST, Cone, or go in for the PBAoE chain.

 

I did not like all the complications of the Corruptor job at first.  But the more I do it the more I find "just Blasting"  a lazy gaming session.  Great sometimes, but not as challenging. 

 

[Erratic1]

1 hour ago, carroto said:

I have plenty of Blasters and Corruptors.  The Blasters tend to get a bit boring after a while.  Corruptors have more to do.  The biggest difference for me in solo play is the "Blast through mez" from the new Defiance.  I couldn't hope to count how many times that has saved me.  It's great to have some way to act to save myself if I don't happen to have a Break-Free on hand, as opposed to just impotently watching myself get defeated.

 

By definition you cannot be wrong about how you feel. I am going to toss in a different perspective....

 

For me, Blasters are enjoyable for the variety of ways they do damage. I do agree, Corruptors (and Defenders) have plenty to occupy their time ala, "Oh, I guess I will try to keep this team member alive...and perhaps its a good time to provide <X> buff to the group...and hey, I am about to light that group up." Blasters are more, "Oh, a group that needs damage...and now I'll kill you over there...hey, is that a group of 12 that needs loving from my T10?"

 

For a bit boring after a while, I tend to look more at Sentinels. There is relaxing sameness to, "Blast you, blast you, BLAST YOU!"* but it is probably the least varied of the lot.

 

 

*Sometimes your primary powerset has a power with a secondary effect which spices things up, or perhaps your secondary or epic powerset, but on the whole it is (a) see target, (b)blast target, (c) if target still alive go to [\b]  else go to [a].

 

Edited November 20, 2022 by Erratic1