Vahz are not overpowered as a group, you just have to prioritize how you fight them.

[DougGraves]

People often complain that vahzilok are overpowered at low levels.  They are not.  You just have to know how to fight them, particularly prioritizing which to attack and cc.  Experienced players know this and can defeat them without difficulty.

 

The cadavers are resistant to several types of cc but they are easy to knockback and more importantly to slow.  They move slowly, so you can use your powers to keep them from reaching you.  What works great against them are the various rains that do damage and slow.  Also aoe knockbacks like storm has with its wind powers like gale.  And stunning them works well.

 

Mortificators can rez the cadavers, even though the mortificators themselves are not as damaging.  So kill mortificators first.

 

The reapers are weak.  Basically ignore them and kill them last.

 

So to sum up, when fighting vahzilok: seasoned players don't fear the reapers.  They use wind, stuns, and rains.  You can be like they are.

[Dona Eis Requiem]

I wonder if these complaints come from the Zoombies? (Their SS,  -fly, and 'splosions are new to Vahz so maybe?)

[Yomo Kimyata]

As an enemy group, Vahz need more cowbell.

[Techwright]

I was unaware this was a concern.  If anything, the Vahz feel less dangerous than in the oldest days of CoH.  I never noticed developer notes suggesting they'd toned down the Vahz, but I can remember teams getting obliterated by swift, paralyzing crossbow attacks, devastating exploding Vahz, and cleanup-positioned Eidolons.    If anything, the first two tickle now with an occasional bloody nose.

 

Are these players running missions at high or max settings?

[macskull]

I think most of the "Vahz are overpowered" sentiment comes from the lieutenants and bosses having some pretty hefty debuff ability and CC when most players are at a level where they can't handle those. If I get smacked with a bunch of -rech at level 50, sure it sucks but I probably still have a complete attack chain or two. If I am level 6 and have like two attacks with no enhancements it's a different story.

[aethereal]

Also the zombies are blind if you kill all the humans.

[Triumphant]

They do a lot of damage at very low levels.  I typically AE level to 16 with new characters, though, so it's not really an issue for me personally.  🤷‍♂️

[Greycat]

I've got to say I'm more annoyed with when you first hit Mu. Low level end drain *sucks.*

[Luminara]

2 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

As an enemy group, Vahz need more cowbell.

 

[Miss Magical]

The secret low-level anti-Vahz weapon is the stun grenade from the P2W vendor. It is an aoe stun that recharges in 16 seconds.

[Chrono-Bot]

3 hours ago, DougGraves said:

So to sum up, when fighting vahzilok: seasoned players don't fear the reapers.  They use wind, stuns, and rains.  You can be like they are.

Beautiful.

[aethereal]

I see someone replied "confused" to my earlier post, so:  little known fact about the Vahz.  The zombies are blind, or nearly so.  Without a human in their spawn, they'll only notice you if you directly attack them.

 

If there's an unaggroed group of zombies (and only zombies), you can kill them one-at-a-time, and only the one you directly attack will notice you and fight back.

 

If there's a mixed group of zombies and humans, you can kill all the humans, then retreat and let them unaggro, at which point you can go and kill the zombies one-at-a-time.

 

If you actually damage (or, affect with a power that draws aggro) multiple zombies (with an AoE or aura, for example), then they'll wake up and notice you.  And if you're standing RIGHT next to one , like literally right on it, and you attack another one, it might notice you.  And if there's a human in the spawn, they'll all aggro as normal, and won't revert to their blind status unless they un-aggro (so you need to run and break LOS, mostly).  But if you're having trouble with a group, it's a pretty good way to safely take them all out.

 

EDIT:  I note here that when I say "zombies," what I really mean are Cadavers, Embalmed Cadavers, Abominations, Embalmed Abominations, and Diseased Abominations.  Not Eidolons, and I assume probably not Zoombies either.

Edited September 12, 2021 by aethereal

[A Cat]

2 hours ago, Miss Magical said:

The secret low-level anti-Vahz weapon is the stun grenade from the P2W vendor. It is an aoe stun that recharges in 16 seconds.

I never really used the P2W powers. I never knew it had such good stuff. That baseball bat attack with KB is a pretty decent damage attack. I have to load up on whatever new character in the future. It seems like it would really help in the early levels. 

 

2 hours ago, Greycat said:

I've got to say I'm more annoyed with when you first hit Mu. Low level end drain *sucks.*

-Recharge is my least favorite thing on lowish levels personally. There's no inspiration that counters that yet! Damn Psi/darts/ice. Then again a large proportion of my characters have electric armor. 

[Xenosone]

Vaz and cot are rough at low levels. The -rech is brutal when your attack chain is brawl a couple longiah temp powers and 2 very underdeveloped attacks. Cot just spam -tohit plus a couple mez. 

 

Redside has a much better enemy progression fighting mooks, family and snakes at that level. 

[Greycat]

4 hours ago, Xenosone said:

 Cot just spam -tohit plus a couple mez.

 

 

Not just -tohit but +def. Run a posi, get stuck with attacks doing -tohit, auras from the demon lords doing -tohit, and Ruin mages (if you can stand up - hit a breakfree) giving +def... not fun. (Though a nice sleep breaks that bubble, from a distance...)

[DreadShinobi]

9 hours ago, A Cat said:

 

-Recharge is my least favorite thing on lowish levels personally. There's no inspiration that counters that yet! Damn Psi/darts/ice. Then again a large proportion of my characters have electric armor. 

Using purple insps before you are attacked will counter recharge debuffs by way of not being hit by them.

 

This is the same logic behind IO set bonuses granting defense bonuses being so powerful. If you avoid the attack you avoid the damage in addition to any debuff or mez effects.

[tidge]

19 hours ago, DougGraves said:

So to sum up, when fighting vahzilok: seasoned players don't fear the reapers.  They use wind, stuns, and rains.  You can be like they are.

 

My character with the Sorcery pool uses Arcane Bolt to abra the cadavers before they can reach out and grab her.

[Coyotedancer]

They can be annoying at low levels... but if you don't just Leeroy into a group without picking your targets they're not so bad. Madness Mages popping up before anyone has mez protection are worse. Learning to keep a few breakfrees handy whenever some mean contact sent me into Perez was a lesson picked up the hard way. 😝  

[Sovera]

As someone who soloed Posi 1 and 2 at (nearly) level appropriate Vhaz really are tough. But the fact I soloed them at x6 or x8 at level appropriate (AKA slot starved and without all the goodies in place) also says it can be done. But inspirations can be the secret sauce.

 

No, as bad as Vhaz can sometimes be (KILL THE GREEN EYE LASERING EIDOLON!!!!!) it's low level CoT that are a complete nightmare.... but again, having soloed Posi 1 and 2 it is also doable. Still nightmare though.

 

-ToHit ON TOP of the deflection bubble on top of -def, sometimes all applied in AoE -and- auto-hit because why not

[Yomo Kimyata]

Honestly, they are not as bad as Antimatter’s robots.  At least you generally get Vahz at low levels.

 

But at high levels you get vast numbers of Scrub Bots, debuffing your defense with ranged energy attacks when your defenses are capped to melee and smashing.

And no, I don’t want no Scrubs.  A Scrub is a bot that can’t get no love from me.

 

[Wavicle]

There is one more important element that is not mentioned here.

The zombies are DUMB. What importance is that you ask?

The zombies need a human to give them orders. If you kill all the Reapers and Mortificators and then fall back a little ways the zombies will forget about you and stop attacking. You can then pick them off one at a time or separate them out a bit.

Edited September 12, 2021 by Wavicle

[Sovera]

1 hour ago, Wavicle said:

There is one more important element that is not mentioned here.

The zombies are DUMB. What importance is that you ask?

The zombies need a human to give them orders. If you kill all the Reapers and Mortificators and then fall back a little ways the zombies will forget about you and stop attacking. You can then pick them off one at a time or separate them out a bit.

 

It was 😄 But yeah, it's a near hidden mechanic. In a full team in particular, but a good tidbit for soloers. Also a great little mechanic to add regardless.

[aethereal]

2 hours ago, Wavicle said:

There is one more important element that is not mentioned here.

Yeeesss....  not....  mentioned here....

[Riverdusk]

Always been a group for me that is definitely harder for my melee characters rather than my ranged ones.  My ranged characters can pick them off pretty easy as the zombies move so slow, even if you don't have any knockback or slows.  Melee kind of has to get in there and they can hurt close up.  Of course as mentioned you can take them out pretty easy regardless with good use of temp powers.  

[Xenosone]

On 9/12/2021 at 1:52 AM, Greycat said:

 

Not just -tohit but +def. Run a posi, get stuck with attacks doing -tohit, auras from the demon lords doing -tohit, and Ruin mages (if you can stand up - hit a breakfree) giving +def... not fun. (Though a nice sleep breaks that bubble, from a distance...)

Forgot about ruin mages. They are aptly named from the bubble to the earthquake. Pretty sure my ingame ptsd is off the charts.

 

As an aside for posi 1 smaller groups tend to not spawn ruin mages. Also makes the shadow you's a more interesting fight