There needs to be a leaver penalty

[lemming]

2 hours ago, Luminara said:

I had to bury eight kittens this month, none of them with their eyes open yet, and a mama cat, Macy, who left behind five kittens.  Petty shit isn't even a blip on my radar.

Ouch.   Though I find the more carp I deal with at the shelter, the less I can deal with petty stuff.

[Haijinx]

7 hours ago, Shenanigunner said:

 

So a TL sees that Ima Butthole has "crashed out" 25 times in two weeks. Probably a player to avoid in any case, even if they're just running a crappy connection. I just suggest it's a different category from directly quitting.

 

/nohorseinthisrace

You kinda come off like you have a horse in this race. 

[Sanguinesun]

7 hours ago, Lunar Ronin said:

 

There are Excelsior players on Indomitable, but they stick to AE farming.  Seriously, about a quarter to a third of Indomitable's population at any time are Excelsior players AFK AE farming while they actually play on Excelsior.

 

I wish I was joking.

 

 

You're not wrong though its not only excelsior either these days(everlasting sends some there too).  I've sent more than a few other there because they didnt realize that it was double exp and that they can plvel what ever they want there, then xfer them back to excel/everlasting.  Or yes, they just keep their afk farming running there while they play the other servers of their choice too of course.

 

5 hours ago, Haijinx said:

You kinda come off like you have a horse in this race. 

 

They do of course else they'd've not expressed their passion on the subject otherwise.

[Frunobulax]

Maybe people are crashing more? Last night on a *raid my game randomly froze up and gave the windows 10/11 prompt you get when a fullscreen program crashes.

 

When I came back online I was in Pocket D, and the leader tried inviting me right away and then again after a relog, and I was denied with some message that iirc was "instance can not be formed" or something like that.

 

I've been playing off and on since early '19, I have a huge family and while they don't all play regularly, I've physically seen this game run on quite a few different computers including a few potatoes and I've never seen that happen before.

 

I have been on enough raids that if I even tried guessing at the number it could probably be credibly used against me to argue that I should not be able to sign legal documents by myself.

 

 

*No, I absolutely will not stop referring to group+ content in any game as a raid.

[Ravenplume]

22 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

 

There must be 50 ways to love your leaver.

 

Even Paul himself admitted that...

 

[Haijinx]

49 minutes ago, Frunobulax said:

Maybe people are crashing more? Last night on a *raid my game randomly froze up and gave the windows 10/11 prompt you get when a fullscreen program crashes.

 

 

I was rubberbanding yesterday.

 

Oh wait - more people are playing!! 

 

Hew you kids, get off my lawn!!

[Doomguide2005]

I got a thought or two.  Something in life comes up.  I get and would say sending a message is the polite and correct thing to do.  But you had better not start accusing anyone of leaching next if they are just staying logged in to the league/tf/etc.. to avoid your large penalty for leaving because the stove caught fire, the child is puking all over suddenly or the neighbor/law enforcement coming knocking at the door.

 

PS I can't even log into the game atm for reasons of I have no clue.  Just keeps saying I can't connect to the server ... so add that sort of thing to the list of "shit happens" that folks can't control.

 

PS2  And just like that everything is back to normal and I can get in game.

Edited May 12 by Doomguide2005

[Ravenplume]

Or like what happened to me a week or two ago (thankfully I wan't in a TF or league or anything, just chatting with some new friends in Pocket D...)

 

Lights flicker, and suddenly go out due to some big incident outside of town that took out the city's power for an hour or two.

 

Nothing I could do to get back in and let everyone know I won't be back for a while.

[BlackSpectre]

The best advice I can give is be completely upfront about how long it will take to complete the task force/trial when you are recruiting. Also let them know that without them the entire team will not be able to complete the task force/trial so you're depending on them to stay. Veterans know how long they take, but newbies don't. 

[Ghost]

I feel like every time someone abandons a TF, they should auto flagged.

Once 7 are flagged, they are auto transported to a random TF with Snarky as the leader.  
They can never log onto another toon, or account.  They are all trapped together until the TF is completed.

 

 

[Greycat]

54 minutes ago, BlackSpectre said:

 Also let them know that without them the entire team will not be able to complete the task force/trial so you're depending on them to stay.

 

...except that's rarely true.

[Haijinx]

57 minutes ago, Ghost said:

I feel like every time someone abandons a TF, they should auto flagged.

Once 7 are flagged, they are auto transported to a random TF with Snarky as the leader.  
They can never log onto another toon, or account.  They are all trapped together until the TF is completed.

 

 

I would be totally against this if it weren't  for the Snaky caveat.

[Scarlet Shocker]

On 5/11/2024 at 2:07 PM, Yomo Kimyata said:

Give me a leaver long enough and I shall move the world.

 

 

you need a Fulcrum _(to) Shift it

[Akisan]

On 5/11/2024 at 4:41 AM, Sanguinesun said:

2. We don't know if the leader or other members of the team were being toxic or otherwise contributing to a run being unpleasant etc.

 

This.  So much this.  I (thankfully) haven't had this problem on HC, but there were a few instances on Live where I couldn't quit team/block/report fast enough.

 

[Neiska]

I foresee absolutely no way this could possibly backfire.  🍿

[Sanguinesun]

7 hours ago, Akisan said:

 

This.  So much this.  I (thankfully) haven't had this problem on HC, but there were a few instances on Live where I couldn't quit team/block/report fast enough.

 

 

 

It happens on HC too. You've just been fortunate not to encounter them.

[Triumphant]

It just comes with the territory when running PUG's.  Also, this game is incredibly easy.  If you can't pick up the slack from having someone drop and still succeed at the mission, you need to practice more.

 

And this is coming from someone who is a relatively mediocre player, all things considered.

[Sir Paladin]

On 5/10/2024 at 11:59 PM, Lines said:

I agree. One of my biggest bugbears is being around people who leave things unfinis

I see what you did th

[Ukase]

So, I have been on a fair number of iTrials with LB3K. He is a chill leader, for the most part. Certainly a better disposition than mine as far as averages go. My jokes are better because Brain really doesn't put puns in his pop menus. 

But I digress. There was a time when Brain was promoting a discord he used; not sure if Brain still uses it, but he hasn't promoted its use at the beginning of Master iTrial runs like he has in the past. 
See, on Discord, when a player is crashing, they can let you know. Without it - they can't. 
About 2-3 years ago, doing an MoUGT with Cosmic Council, the server had a hiccup and shut the game down on all of us. Without Discord, I'm not sure I could have remembered every player's global to /tell them to "rejoin event already in progress". With Discord, I was and we did get the MoUGT a few moments later. 

Now, I'm not schilling for Discord. My headphones with the built in mic - they're noise cancelling. And in the Gulf Coast, especially during summer, they make my ears very uncomfortable. I don't like them, but I spend more money than I'm comfortable stating in writing, so I will use them until the break. Thankfully, the cord is super long and I'm likely to trip over it and rip it in two one of these days. But I digress. 

The replies to Brain make it clear they don't think it's a good idea, and some have even shared why. 

I don't know what a good solution is, because there's been many times when I've been on master TF or Trial runs and things have happened to other players. Sometimes they come back and explain bad weather or whatever, and sometimes they don't. 

I certainly understand LB3K's frustration at players who don't see the badge part of the game as a short term commitment of time. And focus. 

Certainly, a newer player may not understand how other players might feel about it. And it's also a valid perspective that some players just don't care. Their girlfriend came in the room wearing nothing, the tv show they forget about suddenly popped in their minds, they got hungry...anything could have happened that may have been more interesting or entertaining than whatever CoH was offering in that moment. There's a lot of players that will point blank tell you they don't owe any team a damn thing. If they want to quit, they'll quit and won't sweat it even a tiny bit. 

Back on retail, I don't know how it started or how it spread, but it was considered a major social blunder to quit a tf and leave your team hanging - even if you had no idea who they were. That may have more to do with how delicate team compositions were back then. Now, except for the advanced mode content and certain Master TFs, it really doesn't matter if someone drops - unless maybe your team is already small and they had a key role in being able to complete the effort, whatever it might be. 

Unfortunately, I think the best way to prevent such things is the rating system that's already built in. Right click, 1 star, with a note as to why. 
For someone like Brain who tends to lead with the same character repeatedly, there wouldn't be an issue of whether or not alts can see these ratings. (I'm just not sure if they do at the moment) It would add an extra few second to each player he invites, and I can see why any leader would want to avoid this process. But, until someone smarter comes up with a FAIR solution that doesn't screw other players over, it's probably the best we're going to get. 

[Duckbutler]

I've no strong opinion here.

 

On the one hand, on FFXIV we have a leaver penalty for duty content. All it does is lock someone from joining another duty for 30 minutes and then life goes on just as it did before and all is well. Technically I think it can balloon into something larger, but nobody I know has ever had a problem with that. There's also the caveat that it only applies during the first 15 minutes of the run. It's very minor, any given dungeon or normal raid can be completed in that much time so it does encourage people to stick it out unless there's something truly awful going on. If you accidentally eat the penalty because of a DC or a child pooped her pants when you thought you finally had 15 minutes to yourself to do something fun and now she's relentlessly pulling on your arm and accidentally hits a button... Well, the penalty is usually mostly done by the time you're back.

 

On the other hand, I've been playing this game a lot the last few months as a nice low stress alternative. I exclusively and explicitly PUG, even when I'm running into some of the preformed groups that are only filling empty spots with people from LFG. I cannot think of a single case in the last 4 months where someone leaving early was a genuine problem. Any case where it was a problem, that team had other issues that were far worse.

[lemming]

29 minutes ago, Ukase said:

For someone like Brain who tends to lead with the same character repeatedly, there wouldn't be an issue of whether or not alts can see these ratings. (I'm just not sure if they do at the moment)

Notes are saved locally with their global.   It will list the characters of the player though just the ones you've seen, though that will be updated when you open notes.

 

LB3K is a good lead, but it is herding cats, and the cats are fractious.

[Lunar Ronin]

23 minutes ago, Duckbutler said:

I've no strong opinion here.

 

On the one hand, on FFXIV we have a leaver penalty for duty content. All it does is lock someone from joining another duty for 30 minutes and then life goes on just as it did before and all is well. Technically I think it can balloon into something larger, but nobody I know has ever had a problem with that. There's also the caveat that it only applies during the first 15 minutes of the run. It's very minor, any given dungeon or normal raid can be completed in that much time so it does encourage people to stick it out unless there's something truly awful going on. If you accidentally eat the penalty because of a DC or a child pooped her pants when you thought you finally had 15 minutes to yourself to do something fun and now she's relentlessly pulling on your arm and accidentally hits a button... Well, the penalty is usually mostly done by the time you're back.

 

Yeah, just about every other MMORPG has a penalty for leaving instanced content early, which is why I would be fine with it in CoH as well.

[Duckbutler]

2 minutes ago, Lunar Ronin said:

 

Yeah, just about every other MMORPG has a penalty for leaving instanced content early, which is why I would be fine with it in CoH as well.

 

It doesn't need to be more than a slap on the wrist to make a difference. Making it A) proportionate/appropriate to the offense and B) clearly communicated to the player would be key. Right now, I'm unaware of any way to check on your lock outs for task force and giant monster rewards, something already in the game. If a leaver penalty were implemented we would also need an easy way to track it. Perhaps as a tab in the LFG system?

[kelika2]

Stuck enemy and no CSR online

irl storms

irl family

terrible team makeup.  as your suggestion stands the people who grief others with knockback, repel and teleporting of various types have all the power and the person bullied out of the team takes all the punishment

 

city of heroes has always been casual since its introduction and these punishing things dont fit

[Frozen Burn]

No, just No.  There are too many reasons already stated in this thread as to why someone might have to intentionally leave (life interfering) or accidentally leave (technical difficulties).

 

I am sick and tired of people wanting systems in place to punish the few bad apple players out there even at the expense of penalizing all the other good players out there.

 

Just play the game and show a little understanding and compassion that life happens and once in a blue moon, your TF/raid/mission/whatever might fail.  You have no way to know why they dropped.  So, pull up your big boy/girl/trans/whatever-you-identify-as pants and move on and try again some other time.  People need to quit trying to seek vengeance on others.  

 

 

Edited May 14 by Frozen Burn