MASSIVELY: Has Homecoming torched the plans of City of Heroes successors?

[PeregrineFalcon]

So on my favorite MMO News site, Massively Overpowered, Eliot wrote an article that shows that he has the ability to read my mind. Into the Super-Verse: Has Homecoming torched the plans of City of Heroes successors?

 

You have to admit that it's a great question! 🙂

 

Also, please don't freak out like you all did last the time I started a thread about a Massively article.

[TheZag]

Im thinking homecoming and other city of heroes servers wont make much difference for the development of those games.  Unless something changes and homecoming starts an ad campaign,  this is still pretty much a word of mouth game.

 

There would be some overlap but generally speaking,  people will usually choose private server or retail server so they are only kinda in competition with each other.

[Luminara]

I'd have to say that it was the general lack of progress displayed over nearly a decade that put the kibosh on the successors.  None of them were showing any sign of a live release before Co* was brought back, after all, so it's not like Co* being back changed anything.

[iBot]

Game development is chaotic in the best of times.  Worrying about the impact of CoX on any current or future development is kinda like worrying about how oh say Path of Exile is affected by Grim Dark.  Or any other games that are all in the same genre or share a common theme.  Games for better or worse stand on their own merit.  Now is there the will in the industry to fund a project in the vain of CoX?  Who knows.  According to the article there were kickstarters out there that fizzled and major titles that failed to scratch the superhero itch as well as CoX did.  But I personally think anyone with guts in the industry would look at what HC is doing and say "Gee, I wonder if we could turn all those fans into paying customers?".  Which is essentially what 100% of developers want.  So I'd say my take on the article is that the author is worrying for no good reason other than to get us to click the article.

[Without_Pause]

2 minutes ago, Luminara said:

I'd have to say that it was the general lack of progress displayed over nearly a decade that put the kibosh on the successors.  None of them were showing any sign of a live release before Co* was brought back, after all, so it's not like Co* being back changed anything.

+1. As much as I think SoH has a chance of coming out, the narrative was it was a game already being built, and they were going to reskin it into a superhero game. Ok fine, but why is a dev studio taking this long to not actually hit going live? What does that tell us about said studio? At this point, what is coming out first? Winds of Winter, The Doors of Stone, or a CoH spiritual successor? Because Lordy, it has been some time.

[The_Warpact]

I don't think anything would ever happen. Not saying that HC or any other server stopped that. But, with the fever pitch of comic book movies out there then a super mmo should have come out then.

Not necessarily saying that ship has sailed either but realistically I dont think mmo subs are really there anymore imo.

[roleki]

If anything, the existence and success of Homecoming should encourage successors, not deflate them.

[Glacier Peak]

35 minutes ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

So on my favorite MMO News site, Massively Overpowered, Eliot wrote an article that shows that he has the ability to read my mind. Into the Super-Verse: Has Homecoming torched the plans of City of Heroes successors?

 

You have to admit that it's a great question! 🙂

 

Also, please don't freak out like you all did last the time I started a thread about a Massively article.

This reads like an opinion piece about super hero videogames, not really Homecoming specifically. Neither for or against, I suppose. I wish I had a platform to rant and get paid for it!

[Without_Pause]

DC already did an MMO and Marvel has their games. I think an indie IP would be needed to make a splash. If Greater Than Games got with a decent enough dev team, I can see Sentinels of the Multiverse being of note. Not sure if the dev team behind the app for the card game would be the right team. GTG's attempt at a miniatures game bombed terribly, so yeah. Maybe some other Superhero RPGs could make a splash as well. 

[PeregrineFalcon]

24 minutes ago, Without_Pause said:

+1. As much as I think SoH has a chance of coming out, the narrative was it was a game already being built, and they were going to reskin it into a superhero game.

Wait, what? I didn't know that. I thought that, like the others, it was always intended to be a CoH successor. Well, now I've learned something new. Thanks!

[Without_Pause]

They turned it into one once they found out CoH was going away. It has been years, but that's how I remember it. Even if not true, it is telling a dev studio is taking this long. 

[Triumphant]

I hadn't heard of either of these two games, prior to your post.

 

Looking at each game, it seems (to me, at least) like City of Titans is dead in the water.  Ship of Heroes seems to have a pretty structured and active development and PR team, though, so it may yet reach the finish line.

 

I think if either of the games is released to the public and, if they are good games, they will attract a loyal base of players.  There are dozens and dozens of fantasy and sci-fi mmos on the market, but only a handful of super hero rpgs.  People that love that genre want more choices to scratch the itch, and competition is never a bad thing IMO.

 

 

[Shenanigunner]

2 hours ago, The_Warpact said:

Not necessarily saying that ship has sailed either but realistically I dont think mmo subs are really there anymore imo.

 

I'd tend to agree. There never were very many, most of the others had huge flaws (such as being locked to a particular model or universe) and the genre seems to remain the redheaded stepchild of the industry.

 

As much as I had hopes for CoT, I think that team discovered what too many studios DON'T learn in time: you can build 80% of a game pretty quickly, but the last few steps, which involve making everything mesh on a server, environment, player and UI level, can be everything. Yep, with an engine and libraries and existing art, you can slap together a game sim in days. But far too many games out there, released, are 80% developed.

 

So I'd say that HC is it... and  hope that it leads to perhaps a coalition building on it, the notions of CoH2, CoT etc. to maybe bring this rather small player community a next-gen world that preserves all that's best about CoX.

 

Strange, really. As a very boring monogamous gamer (one at a time until people are saying "Jeez, that still runs?") I just don't get the interest in 578 "realistic modern combat" games and 1,192 "Not Quite Lord of the Rings" variants. (The plethora of Hey Look It's Like Star Wars games... I guess I understand.) (ETA: and FFS, how long can anyone play variants of The Tottering Deadites?)

 

Never have flat-out loved anything, in 40 years, like this place. Still not the least bored with it, no matter how much I might hope to come around a corner on some completely new aspect.

 

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by Shenanigunner

[The_Warpact]

3 minutes ago, Shenanigunner said:

 

 

Never have flat-out loved anything, in 40 years, like this place. Still not the least bored with it, no matter how much I might hope to come around a corner on some completely new aspect.

 

 

I agree, I just can't get bored with any out it, I'm still discovering new things and I've been here since I5.

[Shenanigunner]

1 minute ago, Krimson said:

The thing about being a City of Heroes successor is that, in order to be viable, you need a product. So in that sense, yes Homecoming is causing a disruption to the other projects, because Homecoming exists as a functional game that people can play.

 

Correct, but CoX was gone from all but a few secretive b*stards for many years, and CoT's tepid progress was all it generated. So not sure the presence of HC is all that much hindrance to a new world.

 

But it does say a vast amount about just how good the original concept, development and recent years of tweaks are. Tough act to follow. 🙂

[arcane]

A superior game might have torched plans for surely inferior games? Cry me a river 😉

[Black Zot]

5 hours ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

So on my favorite MMO News site, Massively Overpowered, Eliot wrote an article that shows that he has the ability to read my mind. Into the Super-Verse: Has Homecoming torched the plans of City of Heroes successors?

 

You have to admit that it's a loaded question! 🙂

 

FTFY.

[Dazl]

I would much rather have a dedicated group of devs who love, know and respect the game and want to improve it, then people who don’t have the same level of passion producing an inferior product. The fact that none of the new games are even close to ready since the CoX shut down speaks volumes. Sure updated graphics and a fresh coat of paint is nice but it the core game we love, and really considering it’s age the graphics are not that bad.

 

Well if anything articles like that may bring new eyes to the fact that CoX is back.

[Oubliette_Red]

Kudos to the HC team of volunteers for not only resurrecting and keeping afloat CoH, but in actually improving on the Legacy game.

 

Regarding the various successor games that tried to build their own brand, it was a nice idea but unless you've worked in the industry it's pretty easy to underestimate what an undertaking it is to build an MMO from the ground up.

 

[EmperorSteele]

To be fair, I feel like the successors, even SEGs, lost steam after Paragon Chat came out. HC and the other servers were just the final nail in the coffin.

 

If these are still being worked on, then kudos to all involved, but I wouldn't be surprised if half their devs were spending most of their time playing CoH instead of working on their projects.

 

[SmalltalkJava]

COH servers like homecoming have miniscule populations.  It shouldn't have too much effect on the market.  

[OmegaOne]

City of Titans still posts updates, so I guess it's still being worked on, but yeah progress has been slow. I just look at it like this - if they don't produce anything, then nothing changes - I keep playing Homecoming for as long as I can. If they do manage to produce something, then it's a game that I fully intend to check out to see how it compares to CoH. Some of their concepts really interest me (especially the avatar builder and how powers work) and I'd like to try a fully-realized game.

 

As for whether Homecoming tripped up the successors, I honestly hope not. City of Heroes is a great game, but it's not perfect and there is definite room for improvement.

Edited October 21, 2021 by OmegaOne

[PeregrineFalcon]

If City of Titans, or Ship of Heroes or whatever, doesn't launch until after I'm dead then can it truly be called a successor? At least for me it wouldn't be. And isn't my experience what's really important?  😁

[Black Talon]

For my part - and I have virtually zero knowledge, professional or anecdotal, about the industry - I think Autodidactic Philomath has got the stranglehold on the matter.  To the best of my understanding, City of Titans - and this may have well extended to the other successor projects - was a total-volunteer effort.  Despite whatever's been achieved and accumulated through kickstarters, you're always going to be limited to the time, effort, and dedication of your contributing membership.  It shows up enough with pure professionals who are actually paid for their work; families, outside matters, emergency and otherwise, are always going to interfere with completion dates.  CoT and the others may well have had the pure financial requisites to move forward - whether they had a consistent, consistently-competent labour force is another question.

 

Nearly two decades old or not, CoX has got my vote as the best independent superhero universe to work in.  I have no doubt that Marvel and DC called it a day after they consulted the accounting department, took a look at the actuarial tables and decided, Nah...too great an investment for too little a reward.  A study in diminishing returns.  Let's get back to licensing movies and television series.  CoX did and does survive on a diet of sheer love and dedication; no other superhero MMPOG can claim to have even been released to such acclaim, let alone enough to resurrect it back to functional life after nearly a decade.

[A Cat]

4 hours ago, Krimson said:

It's a disruption in the sense that before I saw this thread, I all but forgot those projects existed. 

I never knew they existed before this thread, lol.