Impact of large gifts of influence

[RageusQuitus2]

1 hour ago, Sancerre said:

the only thing left to do (that will provide a 'reward') is to create another character.

Which is the brilliance of this game.

[DoctorDitko]

 

46 minutes ago, RageusQuitus2 said:

Which is the brilliance of this game.

Absolutely! And the hardest part to convey to new players.

 

My ignorance of other MMOs is vast and comprehensive*, is there another we could call out as an example, that emphasizes the journey rather than the destination?

 

* I'm part of the 1%. Yup! You know how Verizon swears up and down they cover 99% of the continental US?

I'm the 1% they suck at! I couldn't play CoH if it hadn't been designed with dial-up users in mind.

Looking forward to Elon finishing ruining the night sky and selling me a Dishy McDishface!

 

[Nerio72]

Make a base on every shard and fill it with purples and rare salvage and then just invite people to go shopping. Let them decide how much is to much.

I'm sure no one will rob you blind 😉

[JnEricsonx]

The effect is being happy you can splurge a bit more on a character!  Seriously, anything you want to donate is fine by me!  🙂   @Doctor Cosmos is me

Edited July 19, 2021 by JnEricsonx
info

[Yomo Kimyata]

8 hours ago, SwitchFade said:

You have 300-500 billion inf?

 

Who doesn't?!

 

By the way, very sad that the name "Interrobang" is already taken on Excelsior and Everlasting.

[Mezmera]

When I see someone in help asking how they can fix endurance issues or some specific problem they are having I like to gift them something like the Panacea proc and like 50 million.  It gives them a good example of what they should be aiming to do and they'll have a decent little bit of money to help experiment with any curiosity that may have been piqued.  

 

Gifting new people some starter funds would nudge the door open a bit easier.  IO's are already intimidating enough having some funds to dabble into it should keep them a bit more interested.  I agree though 500 million is a bit excessive. 

[cranebump]

6 hours ago, Xenosone said:

While most of you are looking at this from the lens of a game its a pretty solid metephor for life. Just giving money to people doesnt solve problems.

Give everyone enough to pay off their car loans and see what happens. I sold some land I inherited several months ago. We paid off both cars and a credit card bill we’d had since moving (again - a move we didn’t get to prepare for). No loans out, you can actually build some wealth and, you know, buy stuff for the grandkids.

 

in any case, my advice about giving someone something. If you're going to monitor how it’s used, don’t bother giving it away in the first place. Worst thing is someone who lends someone a hand, then holds it over them the rest of their lives. It’s a gift, not a small business loan.

Edited July 19, 2021 by cranebump

[Mopery]

I have quite a few top of the line, "money is no limit" built characters.

One of each AT and then some.

 

I don't have a ton of Inf, perhaps 300 million on hand on my whole account.

Probably enough with merits to make 1 more build, which as an altaholic is generally the goal.

Having these things does not interest me enough to play the game on a regular basis.

I play for the comradery and the joy of teaming with this awesome community!

I don't feel like I absolutely must have the best build, or be the most productive member of the team.

I don't mind when the team wipes because we bit off more than we can chew, it's fun giving it our all even if we fail!

Sometimes I like doing easy repetitive TFs, sometimes I like doing hardcore "die and we lose" TFs.

Never since this game began back in 2004 have I felt like I "need" a certain amount of Inf to make it worth my time to play CoH/CoV/GR.

 

I play games to have fun.

 

If I'm not having fun, then I stop playing and find something else to do with my time.

In all this time, I have never played CoH/CoV/GR and not had fun.

I've played other games, and when they became a grind, and it became like work... there was always(ok, except 2012-2019) Paragon City to return home to.

Like many others, there is no way to explain the feeling of loss I had when I couldn't log in and just fly around my beloved city.

Some players will understand exactly how I feel, others will not, and that's okay!

We all play this game for our own reasons, I enjoy making characters and can't play any character for long if I don't like the concept/costume/bio.

Some players want their characters to be maxed out to the nth degree or they can't stand them, even if their costume is generic and their name is xX LEGENDMAN Xx or w/e.

As long as they enjoy it, then good for them.

 

Long story short, I don't know why anyone plays this game, only they know the answer to that question.

 

P.S. - If there is a character named xX LEGENDMAN Xx out there, no offense was meant, you do you, buddy!

[ZorkNemesis]

2 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

Who doesn't?!

 

I don't.  Pretty sure I don't even have 1b across my 110 characters.

[Greycat]

13 hours ago, ILIWAPCT said:

How much is too much?

 

Imagine when you started the game you were given a level 50 and all the IO's you needed? After a week you'd probably move on to a new game.

 

 

... "A" level 50 wouldn't do that. Unlike other games, you don't (say) have "a" fighter type, or "a" rogue or what have you. You can stay in the *same AT* and spend months playing radically different characters. It's one of the things that was, and is, a strength of COH.

 

As far as large gifts? It really depends on the person receiving. I mean, good size "gifts" get given away constantly - costume contests with several hundred million INF, for instance. We often have a "dropship bounty" over on Everlasting and I've seen *that* hit several hundred million INF from people just throwing it in the pot. (Usually ends up in the tens of mil to 100 mill range, if it grows.) Doesn't seem to hurt anyone.

 

*shrug*

[GraspingVileTerror]

I mean, if someone were only motivated by the acquisition of money . . .  sure?

But the anecdotes I hear of people saying they see people leave the game after receiving Inf gifts runs completely contrary to my own experience, where giving gifts of Inf often results in a player sticking around longer.

And really, if the people who are only here for the "bigger numbers grind" get to the end of that particular journey more quickly, I suppose we're just saving them time on the eventual inevitable anyway.  The people who are interested in everything else this game still has to offer will certainly stick around regardless of whatever prizes they end up receiving, free or otherwise.

[ILIWAPCT]

2 hours ago, Mopery said:

I have quite a few top of the line, "money is no limit" built characters.

One of each AT and then some.

 

I don't have a ton of Inf, perhaps 300 million on hand on my whole account.

Probably enough with merits to make 1 more build, which as an altaholic is generally the goal.

Having these things does not interest me enough to play the game on a regular basis.

I play for the comradery and the joy of teaming with this awesome community!

I don't feel like I absolutely must have the best build, or be the most productive member of the team.

I don't mind when the team wipes because we bit off more than we can chew, it's fun giving it our all even if we fail!

Sometimes I like doing easy repetitive TFs, sometimes I like doing hardcore "die and we lose" TFs.

Never since this game began back in 2004 have I felt like I "need" a certain amount of Inf to make it worth my time to play CoH/CoV/GR.

 

I play games to have fun.

 

If I'm not having fun, then I stop playing and find something else to do with my time.

In all this time, I have never played CoH/CoV/GR and not had fun.

I've played other games, and when they became a grind, and it became like work... there was always(ok, except 2012-2019) Paragon City to return home to.

Like many others, there is no way to explain the feeling of loss I had when I couldn't log in and just fly around my beloved city.

Some players will understand exactly how I feel, others will not, and that's okay!

We all play this game for our own reasons, I enjoy making characters and can't play any character for long if I don't like the concept/costume/bio.

Some players want their characters to be maxed out to the nth degree or they can't stand them, even if their costume is generic and their name is xX LEGENDMAN Xx or w/e.

As long as they enjoy it, then good for them.

 

Long story short, I don't know why anyone plays this game, only they know the answer to that question.

 

P.S. - If there is a character named xX LEGENDMAN Xx out there, no offense was meant, you do you, buddy!

QFT. I'm also happy the game is back. As long as the devs keep the game running, 10 years from now, I could easily still see myself playing. I don't need new content. 

 

Back on live, when a single IO would cost the infamy ceiling, I still found a way by running Strike Forces. It was a lot of fun changing from a passive player to a active player. Recruiting and guiding pick up groups. Patiently dealing with newbies and "Expert" players. The journey was a lot of fun. 

 

Homecoming IO prices are reasonable and easily attainable. This time I read the market guide. Some people find the market fun. I prefer to play the game. So I found a method that didn't monopolize my time and worked with my play style. The best thing players could do is put their orders in early, that is if they are not flying from Level 1 to Level  50 in one hour.

 

"I want it now."

"I don't want to do X"

 

There are multiple methods, building, infamy, merits to arrive at a respectable build and still have a lot of fun. 

 

[Ironblade]

On 7/18/2021 at 9:41 AM, Ukase said:

How much is too much? 

 

23 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

People like autonomy.  Sure no one is going to delete an email with half a billion inf (or will they?) but I've found that people seem to prefer receiving amounts that they *want* or *need* rather than big blocks to do whatever they want with.

 

23 hours ago, DoctorDitko said:

Yomo's 20 mill seems to hit a sweet spot.

Since you seem to be cognizant of their builds and such, perhaps focus on one-time gifts of particular enhancements or salvage?

 

Here's the problem.  As far as I can tell, there is no single answer.  It varies according to each persons plans, hopes, expectations, current wealth, etc.

 

Let me tell you a story of the largest amount of inf I gave a single person.  This was back on live, years before shutdown, so inf wasn't quite as easy to get back then.

 

I was duoing with someone late at night on their final push to get to 50.  This was going to be their first 50 on that server, as well as the first 50 in their supergroup.  Once they hit 50, they went to Atlas to train and a bunch of their SG mates showed up to offer congratulations.  I asked what they were going to do now and they said they were going to respec into their final build and that they planned to transfer HALF of their total inf from Freedom (where they had started out) over to Infinity to equip this character.  I casually asked how much inf that was.  They said they had about 100 million on Freedom and so would bring 50 million over to Infinity.  I opened a trade window and gave them 100 million.

They paused and asked, "Are you sure?" because that was a lot of money to them.

I replied, "I'm sure.  That's 5% of what I have just on this one character."

 

If I had given them 10 million, it would have been helpful and a nice surprise.

If I had offered half a billion, it would have been too much.  It would have felt odd.  It could have changed their perception of the game.

The amount I offered was large enough to be startling but not 'more than I've ever seen in my life'.

 

In conclusion - if you're giving money away at random, knowing little or nothing about the recipient, I think it's probably safer to go small than big.  Twenty million gets you a start on your build, or a nice assortment of powers from the P2W Vendor for one character.  My guess would be that you could go as high as 50 million without freaking people out.

[ZemX]

On 7/18/2021 at 8:41 AM, Ukase said:

What I am sweating is if I am ruining their fun by taking away the inherent "carrots" the game has to offer. 

 

I don't think there's one answer to that.  Me, for instance... I can't ever see myself farming.  I don't get it.  I strangely somehow like to watch my characters develop as I play them.  Maybe... I just haven't been playing again as long as some of you, having only just discovered HC this past March.  On the other hand, I sort of think when I get tired of leveling characters up from 0, I will probably be tired of the game and set it aside.

 

Why I mention that... I wouldn't want to be given hundreds of millions of inf.   I'm already sitting on probably 400 million or so across my four 50s and have spent at least that much or more on their builds and those of various mid level characters already.  I have no idea what kind of inf you end up with after being PLed to 50 in a farm, but I've found earning enough to self-fund a character the way I play is pretty easy even doing just the fairly lazy merits -> converters -> cash route and maybe occasionally crafting and selling in-demand IOs that I've been dropped or that I converted.   But I don't spend a whole lot of time at that.  Not like the real marketeers out there earning tens or hundreds of mil a day.  But it's more than enough.   My main 50 is accumulating wealth faster than I have been using it lately and that's just playing the game.  Just piling up merits now and not using them even.

 

My opinion?  I wouldn't drop more than a couple million on someone at a time.  Nobody needs anything to get started but it's a small enough amount (relatively speaking) that I don't think it would affect anyone's enjoyment at earning their own.   I've done that, for example, for some alts where I just drop 1 or 2 million on them and it's plenty to comfortably jump start them into earning their own way.  They can buy some conveniences in P2W in the tutorial at level 1 and their first couple rounds of SOs, by which point they've begun earning merits and making their own money.

 

If I was sitting on THAT many billions, and knowing I wouldn't ever want to hand out more than a million or two at a time... hell, I'd probably just burn most of it.   I mean you could just delete half of it and you wouldn't even notice it was gone.  You're not using it.  

[Ironblade]

22 hours ago, SwitchFade said:

You have 300-500 billion inf?

 

14 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

Who doesn't?!

 

I don't.  But only because there's no point.  I just play the game and, with tens of thousands of reward merits across all my character, what do I need with inf?  'Back in the day', I engaged in every inf-generating activity known.  Now, I don't bother.

[iBot]

My thoughts are only that, opinions.  Personally, I think dropping a large sum of inf on a player is destructive.  You've removed a large portion of the positive feedback reward loop from their experience.  Ask yourself this: why don't we all play on beta server?  There we can insta - 50, give ourselves a complete build, and rampage through the game content as gods so why don't we?  Same goes for giving someone a fully kitted build when they've done nothing to earn it.  Now I can already read some of the push back, "But we PL to 50 and kit out our alts the same way now."  True.  But I'm willing to bet almost no one started that way at least not with their first 50 after coming back.  It was only after that part of the reward lost its appeal that we started to decide that some alts could be taken from concept to complete in a short period.  I know I have though there are still a few characters that I've played from 0 - 50 just because I'd not used the sets before and wanted to see how the mechanics played out before trying to conquer harder stuff.

 

So what to do then with billions of inf that has no use?  I don't have a good answer beyond using it as a reward for good play.  You'll have to decide what good play means.

[Xenosone]

13 hours ago, cranebump said:

Give everyone enough to pay off their car loans and see what happens. I sold some land I inherited several months ago. We paid off both cars and a credit card bill we’d had since moving (again - a move we didn’t get to prepare for). No loans out, you can actually build some wealth and, you know, buy stuff for the grandkids.

 

in any case, my advice about giving someone something. If you're going to monitor how it’s used, don’t bother giving it away in the first place. Worst thing is someone who lends someone a hand, then holds it over them the rest of their lives. It’s a gift, not a small business loan.

Looks at the ghettos of people given money notices several common themes, Looks at homeless people handed money and notices things, redditors miss about life as they live in gated communities 

 

You were saying? 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Xenosone

[Ukase]

Well...I appreciate everyone's perspective. Honestly, I do, that's why I asked.

What I've done today is simply give away 1-3 of the main PvP procs to non-50 characters I saw that weren't already IO'd to the gills. I gave priority to redside, as I figure any reward for playing there is better than nothing. But there weren't that many! So, I went to Talos, Steel and Atlas and I think Pocket D and gave some away there. 

This was on Excelsior; gave away 21 of them. I'll give away another 21 this afternoon. Tomorrow I'll choose another server, and rotate servers at least until I run out of what's in my tray. 
I've got bids in for another 108, replenishing them as I take them out and I'll probably wait a week after the last server and hope I don't run into the same characters again and again. 
If you want these - here's a few tips: 
Don't be hidden. I'm using /search for the lower level zones and putting the character names in a target macro. If I find you, I'll give, but if you're already 50 and already kitted out, I wouldn't see the point. For that matter, if you're level 10 and it looks like you already have them, (per character info/powers - it shows set bonuses) I'll probably overlook you on purpose. 

Oh - if your name is offensive to the point where I wonder why you haven't been generic'd already, I'll overlook you. There's too many decent names still out there. You do you, but I'm not gonna reward characters with names that gross me out. 

[Crystal Dragon]

Admittedly, I skimmed the first few responses so I may sound like I'm repeating others but it's not my intention I swear.

 

I find giving gifts to new players arriving to the servers such as influence is very helpful, though continuing engagement with the players helps with answering questions about skill choices, slotting, enhancements and so forth with keeping them involved and giving them guidance that new players frequently need. When I started out, I scrambled for every iota of inf I could get to just handle slotting and enhancing my character from the start. I didn't know there were leveling farm maps in the AE, or even farmers offering to help players like me. I was going at it pretty much on my own for a long while until I ran into a bunch of the Chaos United members and fell in with them as a friend and coalition leader among them. 

 

I play on Everlasting here, been here since well... a while now. But I am not worried about a players choices to stay or go, but I do keep an eye out for those that stay and try to invite them to raids, TF's and events happening on the server so they have something new to see or do in the game or more access to content not usually available to a solo player.

If I see a new player asking for some help, even if it's just asking about the server community, or aspects of game play, I try to give direction on where they can find their answers, and if I don't know, I try to look it up to see what I can find for myself to assist.

If I had a large sum of inf to hand out, I try to do something more involved with the community so that wealth can spread out, like costume contests, or quiz's and trivia. I don't sit on a wealth of inf a lot of the time because I'm working on at least 12 other characters, beside my main little dragon character here. I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that, depending on the server shard you are on, there's any number of ways to keep the new players involved and giving them a chance to learn the game, how it plays, and what works for them through a little help now and then. 

[Shred Monkey]

I think if it really is a new player, 20M is an ok gift.  It's enough to allow them to experiment and make some mistakes on their "first toon" without completely taking away an essential part of the the "first toon" experience.

[biostem]

The old adage about "teaching a man to fish" comes to mind, here.  Fully kitting out a person's character doesn't teach them about proper slotting or build strategy.  It doesn't explain power mechanics or how set bonuses can improve or completely alter a build.  It doesn't teach them the finer points of teaming dynamics or how a power may be passable on its own, but game-changing once unique or set IOs are factored in.  I'm sure they'd appreciate it, but will they fall into "velocitation" where they expect all future characters to perform at that same level right from the get-go, find that isn't the case, then leave the game out of boredom or frustration...

 

It'd be cool if you could use the AE to create "invitation-only" missions, and personally provide a reward at the end - so users could create tutorials or other "how-to's" and reward those that play them...

Edited July 19, 2021 by biostem

[Bill Z Bubba]

17 hours ago, ZorkNemesis said:

 

I don't.  Pretty sure I don't even have 1b across my 110 characters.

 

Maybe, but what's the "net worth" of all 110 characters if you were to strip them all and sell everything?

 

I rarely have more than a couple billion stray inf laying around but I also buy at "give it to me NOW" prices whatever I don't already have sittin in the base bins.

 

Now the question is... did I open all of those winter packs already? And if not... who has them?

 

 

To the OP, it's nice what you do. Had another forum goer thank me here for dumping a bunch of inf on them and helping them with info WAAAY back before the snap.

 

Giving help, info, inf, yea, even money is nice when there are no strings attached. Especially when it helps someone enough that they then go out and help others.

[Bill Z Bubba]

5 hours ago, iBot said:

Ask yourself this: why don't we all play on beta server?

 

Because it often gets wiped.

[Luminara]

26 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Maybe, but what's the "net worth" of all 110 characters if you were to strip them all and sell everything?

 

Probably an impressive sum.  Strippers make good money.

 

😁

[Myrmidon]

26 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

Because it often gets wiped.

Also, forum population wouldn’t be close to enough teaming opportunities.